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  • AIG to report 60 billion dollar loss, asking for more money

    Originally posted by CNBC
    AIG Seeks More US Funds As Record Loss Looms
    By: David Faber, CNBC Anchor and Reporter | 23 Feb 2009 | 03:00 PM ET

    American Insurance Group, the insurance giant that is 80-percent owned by the US government, is in discussions with the government to secure additional funds so it can keep operating after next Monday, when it will report the largest loss in U.S. corporate history, CNBC has learned.

    Sources close to the company said the loss will be near $60 billion due to writedowns on a variety of assets including commercial real estate.

    That massive loss is likely to spur downgrades in its insurance and credit ratings that will force AIG to raise collateral that it doesn't have.

    In addition, if AIG's book value falls below a certain level, as it seems certain to do, it will trigger default in certain of its debt instruments, say people familiar with the situation.

    All of this adds up to a huge headache for the Federal Reserve and Treasury, which have already provided over $150 billion of assistance to AIG.

    Talks between the government and AIG are focussed on how the company can swap some of the debt held by the government for equity in AIG. The problem is that the government's ownership stake cannot exceed its current 79.9 percent, leaving officials to try and find a creative way to transfer value to the US in exchange for AIG reducing its debt so that it can then borrow more from the government to meet its collateral calls.

    AIG has borrowed roughly $40 billion from a $60 billion credit facility provided it by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. if it can find a way to pay that down by swapping equity, it hopes to take it back up to a level that will allow it to meet its collateral and capital calls.

    AIG's board is scheduled to meet this Sunday night in hopes of hammering out an agreement with the government. But in case it can't, AIG's lawyers at Weill Gotschal are preparing for the possibility of bankruptcy.

    That seems unlikely, but last November, the government took control of many of AIG's credit default swaps and so a bankruptcy of the holding company might not pose the systemic risk it once did.

    AIG officials have not offered comment. Officials at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York have not returned calls.

    Originally posted by Yahoo
    NEW YORK (Reuters) - American International Group, rescued twice last year by the U.S. government, is asking for more aid and bracing for a fourth-quarter loss of roughly $60 billion, a source familiar with the matter said. It would be the biggest loss in a quarter in corporate history.

    The $60 billion would exceed Time Warner's $54 billion single-quarter loss in 2002 and dwarf the $24.5 billion loss AIG posted in the third quarter, when the government increased its rescue package for the insurer to about $150 billion.

    By contrast, two analysts polled by Reuters Estimates have forecast on average a net loss of $5.46 billion.

    The latest round of talks with the government include the possibility of additional funds for the insurer and trading debt for equity, another source said on Monday.
    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/AIG-in...ffkDMZp9y7YWsA

    Can you believe this shit? 60 billion dollar loss after $150 billion dollar bailout and they're asking for more.
    My father in law was telling me over Thanksgiving about this amazing bartender at some bar he frequented who could shake a martini and fill it to the rim with no leftovers and he thought it was the coolest thing he'd ever seen. I then proceeded to his home bar and made four martinis in one shaker with unfamiliar glassware and a non standard shaker and did the same thing. From that moment forward I knew he had no compunction about my cock ever being in his daughter's mouth.

  • #2
    what is it that AIG sells again? oh right, they don't sell products, they sell services. there in lies the problem, they can't just continue on like nothing happened or somehow come up with a better product. I don't know what caused them to lose so much money, but I do know they aren't in a good position to make it back.
    .fffffffff_____
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    .fffffff\______/
    .ffffff/ffff.ffffff\
    .fffff|fffff.fffffff|
    .fffff\________/
    .fff/fffffff.ffffffff\
    .ff|ffffffff.fffffffff|
    .ff|ffffffff.fffffffff|
    .ff\ffffffffffffffffff/
    .fff\__________/

    Comment


    • #3
      Citigroup down to $1.01 a share

      http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYSE_C&v=dmax

      Dow is plummeting

      http://money.cnn.com/data/markets/dow/

      http://www.godlikeproductions.com/

      Karl Denninger the Ticker guy:

      http://market-ticker.org/archives/852-What...-All-Of-It.html

      Just so you have a short list of what's at stake if Washington DC doesn't change policy here and now (which means before the collapse in equities comes, which could start as soon as today, if the indicators I watch have any validity at all. For what its worth, those indicators are painting a picture of the Apocalypse that I simply can't believe, and they're showing it as an imminent event - like perhaps today imminent.)

      * All pension funds, private and public, are done. If you are receiving one, you won't be. If you think you will in the future, you won't be. PBGC will fail as well. Pension funds will be forced to start eating their "seed corn" within the next 12 months and once that begins there is no way to recover.

      * All annuities will be defaulted to the state insurance protection (if any) on them. The state insurance funds will be bankrupted and unable to be replenished. Essentially, all annuities are toast. Expect zero, be ecstatic if you do better. All insurance companies with material exposure to these obligations will go bankrupt, without exception. Some of these firms are dangerously close to this happening right here and now; the rest will die within the next 6-12 months. If you have other insured interests with these firms, be prepared to pay a LOT more with a new company that can't earn anything off investments, and if you have a claim in process at the time it happens, it won't get paid. The probability of you getting "boned" on any transaction with an insurance company is extremely high - I rate this risk in excess of 90%.

      * The FDIC will be unable to cover bank failure obligations. They will attempt to do more of what they're doing now (raising insurance rates and doing special assessments) but will fail; the current path has no chance of success. Congress will backstop them (because they must lest shotguns come out) with disastrous results. In short, FDIC backstops will take precedence even over Social Security and Medicare.

      * Government debt costs will ramp. This warning has already been issued and is being ignored by President Obama. When (not if) it happens debt-based Federal Funding will disappear. This leads to....

      * Tax receipts are cratering and will continue to. I expect total tax receipts to fall to under $1 trillion within the next 12 months. Combined with the impossibility of continued debt issue (rollover will only remain possible at the short duration Treasury has committed to over the last ten years if they cease new issue) a 66% cut in the Federal Budget will become necessary. This will require a complete repudiation of Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, a 50% cut in the military budget and a 50% across-the-board cut in all other federal programs. That will likely get close.

      * Tax-deferred accounts will be seized to fund rollovers of Treasury debt at essentially zero coupon (interest). If you have a 401k, or what's left of it, or an IRA, consider it locked up in Treasuries; it's not yours any more. Count on this happening - it is essentially a certainty.

      * Any firm with debt outstanding is currently presumed dead as the street presumption is that they have lied in some way. Expect at least 20% of the S&P 500 to fail within 12 months as a consequence of the complete and total lockup of all credit markets which The Fed will be unable to unlock or backstop. This will in turn lead to....

      * The unemployed will have 5-10 million in direct layoffs added within the next 12 months. Collateral damage (suppliers, customers, etc) will add at least another 5-10 million workers to that, perhaps double that many. U-3 (official unemployment rate) will go beyond 15%, U-6 (broad form) will reach 30%.

      * Civil unrest will break out before the end of the year. The Military and Guard will be called up to try to stop it. They won't be able to. Big cities are at risk of becoming a free-fire death zone. If you live in one, figure out how you can get out and live somewhere else if you detect signs that yours is starting to go "feral"; witness New Orleans after Katrina for how fast, and how bad, it can get.

      The good news is that this process will clear The Bezzle out of the system.

      The bad news is that you won't have a job, pension, annuity, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and, quite possibly, your life.

      It really is that bleak folks, and it all goes back to Washington DC being unwilling to lock up the crooks, putting the market in the role it has always played - that of truth-finder, no matter how destructive that process is.

      Only immediate action from Washington DC, taking the market's place, can stop this, and as I get ready to hit "send" I see the market rolling over again, now down more than 3% and flashing "crash imminent" warnings. You may be reading this too late for it to matter.

      In 3 minutes, what's coming.....


      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGWMs5cdQ2k

      http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/data/...Max_630_378.png

      Comment


      • #4
        Finally, the hope and change we have all been waiting for!
        Rabble Rabble Rabble

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Tone View Post
          Citigroup down to $1.01 a share

          http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYSE_C&v=dmax

          Dow is plummeting

          http://money.cnn.com/data/markets/dow/

          http://www.godlikeproductions.com/

          Karl Denninger the Ticker guy:

          http://market-ticker.org/archives/852-What...-All-Of-It.html

          Just so you have a short list of what's at stake if Washington DC doesn't change policy here and now (which means before the collapse in equities comes, which could start as soon as today, if the indicators I watch have any validity at all. For what its worth, those indicators are painting a picture of the Apocalypse that I simply can't believe, and they're showing it as an imminent event - like perhaps today imminent.)

          * All pension funds, private and public, are done. If you are receiving one, you won't be. If you think you will in the future, you won't be. PBGC will fail as well. Pension funds will be forced to start eating their "seed corn" within the next 12 months and once that begins there is no way to recover.

          * All annuities will be defaulted to the state insurance protection (if any) on them. The state insurance funds will be bankrupted and unable to be replenished. Essentially, all annuities are toast. Expect zero, be ecstatic if you do better. All insurance companies with material exposure to these obligations will go bankrupt, without exception. Some of these firms are dangerously close to this happening right here and now; the rest will die within the next 6-12 months. If you have other insured interests with these firms, be prepared to pay a LOT more with a new company that can't earn anything off investments, and if you have a claim in process at the time it happens, it won't get paid. The probability of you getting "boned" on any transaction with an insurance company is extremely high - I rate this risk in excess of 90%.

          * The FDIC will be unable to cover bank failure obligations. They will attempt to do more of what they're doing now (raising insurance rates and doing special assessments) but will fail; the current path has no chance of success. Congress will backstop them (because they must lest shotguns come out) with disastrous results. In short, FDIC backstops will take precedence even over Social Security and Medicare.

          * Government debt costs will ramp. This warning has already been issued and is being ignored by President Obama. When (not if) it happens debt-based Federal Funding will disappear. This leads to....

          * Tax receipts are cratering and will continue to. I expect total tax receipts to fall to under $1 trillion within the next 12 months. Combined with the impossibility of continued debt issue (rollover will only remain possible at the short duration Treasury has committed to over the last ten years if they cease new issue) a 66% cut in the Federal Budget will become necessary. This will require a complete repudiation of Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, a 50% cut in the military budget and a 50% across-the-board cut in all other federal programs. That will likely get close.

          * Tax-deferred accounts will be seized to fund rollovers of Treasury debt at essentially zero coupon (interest). If you have a 401k, or what's left of it, or an IRA, consider it locked up in Treasuries; it's not yours any more. Count on this happening - it is essentially a certainty.

          * Any firm with debt outstanding is currently presumed dead as the street presumption is that they have lied in some way. Expect at least 20% of the S&P 500 to fail within 12 months as a consequence of the complete and total lockup of all credit markets which The Fed will be unable to unlock or backstop. This will in turn lead to....

          * The unemployed will have 5-10 million in direct layoffs added within the next 12 months. Collateral damage (suppliers, customers, etc) will add at least another 5-10 million workers to that, perhaps double that many. U-3 (official unemployment rate) will go beyond 15%, U-6 (broad form) will reach 30%.

          * Civil unrest will break out before the end of the year. The Military and Guard will be called up to try to stop it. They won't be able to. Big cities are at risk of becoming a free-fire death zone. If you live in one, figure out how you can get out and live somewhere else if you detect signs that yours is starting to go "feral"; witness New Orleans after Katrina for how fast, and how bad, it can get.

          The good news is that this process will clear The Bezzle out of the system.

          The bad news is that you won't have a job, pension, annuity, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and, quite possibly, your life.

          It really is that bleak folks, and it all goes back to Washington DC being unwilling to lock up the crooks, putting the market in the role it has always played - that of truth-finder, no matter how destructive that process is.

          Only immediate action from Washington DC, taking the market's place, can stop this, and as I get ready to hit "send" I see the market rolling over again, now down more than 3% and flashing "crash imminent" warnings. You may be reading this too late for it to matter.

          In 3 minutes, what's coming.....

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGWMs5cdQ2k

          http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/data/...Max_630_378.png

          IF YOU EVER DREAM OF BEATING ME, YOU BETTER WAKE UP AND APOLOGIZE.


          1:Vermillion Flame> crap, why is it so hard to grab just one newbie lol

          1:Vermillion Flame> i've noticed that. a real lack of supply of players here

          1:Vermillion Flame> i never thought a single newbie could be so precious
          yo dog, I heard you like driving, so we put a car in your car so you can drive while you drive
          Originally posted by tone
          no you son of a bitch debunker

          Comment

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