Public Input for Elim

[Fem.]

I think you guys are forgetting that many Javelin players are also Warbird players. They're not a segregated bunch, so consider that there are those giving input about separating the arenas who play both ships with equal care. Even with separate arenas, as I think it should be, the group of people who play multiple ships still go back and forth between arenas; having a combined arena actually reduces the options for multiple ship players because, say, if one arena has an elim going, they might just as easily want to play in the other ship in another arena because sometimes elims worth playing take a long time to do. Think about it from a player's perspective; you want people to stay in elim? Then give them something to play for, and sometimes good players want to play other good players and they know it will take a while. Contrary to what you might think, many don't mind spectating a good elim. With separate arenas, you'll have people who are good at their chosen ship, and play only those elims, are well-practiced, and will thus provide for better elim experiences for both players and spectators.

[rothe]

actually, you are wrong about that one tiny.

warbird eliminations used to be far more popular than javelin eliminations. however, the merge of the arenas ruined it all in an instant. all of the sudden, javelin started to gain more popularity, and warbirds could never play their type of elim.

I agree WB used to be much more popular than currently but that it was the merger I dono but the WB does need more love.
I still hear from friends about this game... rarely but the reason I get that they dont feel like getting back into it has more to do with resolution and in wb fights seeing that bullet commin gives you that much more of a chance to dodge or shoot. It isnt cheating but it is an unfair advantage if everyone isnt using the same. Thats what I hear about and thats why I dont play anymore. THuure is ur public imput from a casual.

[Jones]

if elims are separated please use same resolution settings in the arena as in twld and please for the love of priitk do not put a box inside the elim map so people can run and hide behind it thus destroying everything

-i don't really support the idea that elims should be separated. force a wb elim every 3 or so games instead
-remove everything but spider, wb, jav elims, spider elim max death 5 unless we see a huge boost. maybe should prevent wb/jav elims to 10 if there are less than 5 people playing
-kill race is pretty useless, limit it to 15 or it should depend on how many people are playing
-scoreresets should happen pretty frequently, regular players should not be able to do it. get dat 36h usage limit back or just add something similar to prevent 1000 aliases

that's it for now, i guess

ps. pub bux sucks

[Rab]

if res limits aren't removed from this game soon it's definitely dead

[Jones]

rab, most top-level wbs have voted for the res-cap to stay in place since it's a huge advantage to have a bigger one. there are many good reasons why it should be raised or removed though. i voted for the res-cap, and if it is removed probably many current wbs will just stop playing. so the question is: keep the old or replace them with new?

[Jones]

now would probably be a good time to discuss this resolution thing... or realize that it has already been discussed and explained many times before thus it would just be a waste of time

[Turban]

idk. i don't care what happens with the resolution limits as long as it remains in TWLD.

[Turban]

both arguments about the resolution limit have their pros and cons all of which need to be weighed properly especially given the current state of the game before making the final decision.

i feel that most of the experienced players would highly prefer everyone playing on a lower resolution for a couple of simple reasons all of which are to increase the competition in the zone. first of all, it makes the game more fair for everyone when there is a set maximum resolution as no one can have a large advantage over you by using an insanely high resolution monitor. secondly, it makes the games far higher paced which means more fun and excitement, and games will be more based on skill, reaction times and experience as you will see a larger amount of close range battles throughout the map. this means the rounds are more exciting as you don't have to rely on your patience when playing against other players, dodging and shooting them even from distances greater than the radar can display. there are some who will argue that playing in that style requires more skill, but that is a big load of bullshit if you ask me. the veteran players would be basically bringing a sword into a bow fight would be a frustrating situation to be in, and while most of us can do have the option to use higher resolution we still refuse to do so for the sake of the competition.

however, our new generation of gamers would much rather take full advantage of their gaming setup and truthfully speaking most of them do not give a damn about the competitiveness of this game. they do not understand the consequences of the change, and no one can really blame them for that -- it's a lack of experience and expertise. nonetheless, we are in a need for new players to save this game from dying, and if we honestly can expect an influx of new players then all of the future changes should take those players into consideration.

we can either go with a short term goal to increase the competitiveness of the zone for a short period of time, but it will hurt us in the long run, or we can take the long term approach. i would much rather take the latter option and pray that a miracle happens in the near future as i would love to play this game with hundreds of other active players. this long term goal would naturally include the separation of elimination arenas (which is a better system with more players) and many other proposed changes in this thread.

i would still keep a resolution limit in TWLD and TWDD main arenas, and have it implemented to TWEL, but elsewhere the resolution limit should be removed.

[Shadowmere]

For people arguing no-res limit:
Anything over Full HD (1920x1080) is about past the in-game radar range.
If anything, that should be the limit. I'm sure most of the no-res limit supporters would be content with that much.
I've played warbird competitively as well as non-competitively both on low res as well as high res.
At the end of the day, my scores have been very similar. I still have to read radar, predict the actions of other players, read into their energy (consumption) and act accordingly.
On high res (FHD), my close-range battling suffers. On low res (~1440x900), my long-range fighting suffers.

Now what I'm talking about is mainly related to TWD and TWL:
I'm an old player and I hate changing resolutions so I can play with my team so much, that 90% of the time I tell them to get a match in DD3 or I'm not playing. - The options are windowed mode or black bars on the side of my monitor, or a stretched image - So a new player with no understanding of the game, its rules and mechanics? Will never get to play a game of TWDD.
It's 2014, almost 15, and you can hardly get a monitor with low-res anymore, unless you're really looking for one (why would you be? ). These are mainly found on laptops. Admittedly a lot of us still connect from a laptop, but new players? No, most of them are on a desktop.

I'd be interested to reset the 'most used resolutions' found from trenchwars.org (go pub stats and at the bottom you see it) to see where we're at currently. Or more accurately, remove the limits (place FHD so radar is still usable) and then reset it. So we know people aren't forced to low res by arenas/games they wanna play.

My arguments are based on experience, though I agree with turban in the fact that games seem more fast paced as people are forced to rush/get close.
All games improve and change though. To my knowledge we've only tested no limit for a small while. Last season. Correct me if I'm wrong.
If we actually let the change mature longer, maybe we would see a new "top level gaming style".

It's only natural the players at the top of the zone in warbird would fight any change that would danger their style of playing and possibly make them learn something new if it doesn't work anymore.
But that's what makes a good player. Being able to adapt. (Re)learn.

Elim hasn't had a res limit for a while. And one shouldn't be brought to it.

[Spacely]

***Please look at signature and see my old elim stats before database was deleted and please consider what i say seriously i have more hours then almost anyone in elim look at how many games i have played and my kill/death is well into in the 6 figures***

i haven't played in years but i have a ton of hours in warbird elim hopefully the rating system has been changed so a player can't just hit a certian ratio and never play again and sit on top it should be on a ladder system like i said in earlier post and you should have to defend your rung to stay on top or lose a rung every so many days you don't play

the elim rating system is the biggest joke i ever seen and don't know how it has stayed in place so long hopefully it is long gone. it is retarded to see someone hit a certian ratio then never ever ever play again and be #1 for months and months but never play 1 match to defend that #1 position

honestly it is the most retarded thing i have ever seen

[Ricko]

looking at your kills:deaths this shouldn't concern you who is in the top 100 of the ladder anyway

[Kim]

We're resetting once every 2-3 months anyways. It would be nice to implement lifetime stats. Vys brought it to my attn, as he plays SVS, and they have a system going on there. Due to our limited resources for coding, it hasn't given me enough incentive to push forward with the idea to our coders.

[Reckful]

rip in peace

[Jones]

A similar monthly rating system as in SVS has been proposed years ago mostly for the TWD stats. Honestly, I like Spacelys point that you should not play the minimum required games and just sit on top there never touching it again until next reset. However, with lack of coders priority should be put into TWL stats, something as simple as adopting the R1234 from TWD and put it into TWL. If able add a K.O/First out and it would already be a huge improvement.

[qan]

Just vetted the code for TW elim stats.


I feel physically ill. It's that bad. I don't want to reveal the details because it's so mind-blowingly embarrassing how the ladder is calculated.


Let's just say it's only marginally better than being random. It means next to nothing.






Fortunately, it's an easy fix, code-wise. We just have to work out a meaningful formula. That's not my area of expertise, but I've got some ideas. The one good thing about this being so awful is that recognizing it means there was something fatally flawed about a staple arena of the zone, and we can do something to fix it. Perhaps the damage has already been done... but then again, it has a chance to rise from the ashes.


Currently several folks are working on a meaningful TWD ladder formula that can accurately represent individual stats. I'd like to do the same for elim, especially because coming up with a more skill-representative formula than what we've got is something that a 12 year old could do, and it's much simpler than TWD as well. In particular, I'd like to incorporate confidence into rating, which has to do with how many games of elim the person has played, so that you stand a much better chance of ranking high the more games you play (well), and resetting your score is only worth doing once things have truly gone south and you're 100+ games in.


Adding in a warmup area to play in while waiting for the next elim is also quite possible. I'm not working on it yet but it's definitely something to look for.