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Thread: TWDT Star Cap System Analysis

  1. #1
    House Targaryen Claushouse's Avatar
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    TWDT Star Cap System Analysis

    I looked at past Finalists in TWDT to see what a contender would look like under an overall star cap limit.



    Based on those averages, if we were to go in that direction, I think cap limits of 425, 425, and 680 would be ideal. Power is the perfect archtype for a 3-league contender that is deep and talented across the board, and as it happens, they fit perfectly within those prescribed limits.

    This would give captains and players more flexibility to create lines that fit their personnel. Of course, with freedom comes abuse, and it is certainly possible you could see lines without players under 80 or over 90. I don't necessarily see an issue with that (it certainly wouldn't be most teams), but others might.
    2:RaCka> I wonder what turban's real name is
    2gron> turb's name IRL is tellixador icantshow
    2:RaCka> LOL
    2:Heaven> LOl

    Ogron> what's your showrate, i got the next FA pick
    24> i can only show Week 2

  2. #2
    House Targaryen Claushouse's Avatar
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    I think the plan is still low star slots, using Centrigrade ratings (0-65 slot, 0-74 slot, 0-83 slot), but an overall star cap is food for thought.

    Zid says overall star cap is trash and there's a reason older seasons were garbage, and a big part was overall caps. I'm inclined to agree, but interested in what others think.
    2:RaCka> I wonder what turban's real name is
    2gron> turb's name IRL is tellixador icantshow
    2:RaCka> LOL
    2:Heaven> LOl

    Ogron> what's your showrate, i got the next FA pick
    24> i can only show Week 2

  3. #3
    Registered User Jessup's Avatar
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    Not quite sure what you mean by this "centigrade" "star cap" stuff.. You mean dropping star ratings altogether and using values to 100 for each player and having a cap on limit of points each team can have? If we drop allowing lower star play the interest will decline imo for the more casual users. The whole twdt star system is flawed but also serves a purpose. There were some ridiculous ratings I thought this year which benefitted teams lines who got them. I feel some changes need to be made ..

    I had an idea of doing draft brackets based off rating formed in small groups of 6 players (for the number of teams used which I suppose will be 6 again) Have a TWDT council of 5 to 7 people vote for these ratings and the groupings and base them in descending order of rating. The top bracket of 6 being the best overall rated players and descend it down from there. Picks start with random num generator and are done so each captain gets ONE pick per grouping. Alternate the first pick from there on for each captain so it's fair. This way each team gets a more even distribution of talent. The giant free for all in draft pool is one reason the seasons have so many blowouts. If we narrow it down I feel the competition would be much more evenly distributed.

  4. #4
    Registered User olde's Avatar
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    Lol this would make it so much more complicated, there is like 50 players left. Everyone knows who can play at what level in each ship its such a tight Niche community almost don't even need ratings

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    Heh I quite like the idea of a draft without ratings.

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    Major Crisis/Ownix Major Crisis's Avatar
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    I see Vys did actually a great job ranking me. Atleast if 86 = 8* and so on.

    But I think this is gonna be too complicated for the captains (and assistants) to make a line. If I saw with ALF half the team had no clue what the rankings of others were. It's also not easy to check for the host to allow the line up I think.. I think the 'old' system is fine, but just needs some work on the ratings. Pretty sure we all agree that ratings should be done by multiple people next season and maybe do something about the 8*'s, cuz they end up in no mans land.
    Major Crisis

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    zeebu 'DUMPTRUCK' johnson Zeebu's Avatar
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    i still like the overall cap idea, it would just need to be tailored to each league after the draft took place. aim to the lower side and make it so if you play more than a couple top dogs you need to put in some lower rated people. with the 425 cap for example, it allows for a lineup of: 100 95 85 75 70. i think an average rating of 85 is too high, maybe we should aim for an average of 75-80 instead.

    or, for a really whackadoo idea, make the entire thing a points based league and give teams bonus points for being under the cap. really give an incentive to caps for going playing low rated folks. but still make it worthwhile to win or be competitive.


    1996 Minnesota State Pooping Champion

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    booo

    just more effort on the ratings, same system

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    EG is testing out a draft league without ratings right now. It's the first time it's happened so time will tell how it turns out but might work for TW too.

  10. #10
    House Targaryen Claushouse's Avatar
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    I think 98% of the zone really likes the current system of 6-Star and 7-Star, and that it has produced the best seasons of TWDT.


    Forums are statistically inaccurate, because people with complaints naturally gravitate towards posting, while people who are content don't.


    There are like 250-300 signups every season, and 10 people who are unhappy posting seems very potent on the forums where they represent 10 of 17 posters in a thread, despite representing 3-4% of players.


    Also, most complaints stem from the ratings, not the system itself.
    2:RaCka> I wonder what turban's real name is
    2gron> turb's name IRL is tellixador icantshow
    2:RaCka> LOL
    2:Heaven> LOl

    Ogron> what's your showrate, i got the next FA pick
    24> i can only show Week 2

  11. #11
    Registered User Jessup's Avatar
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    I def feel we should do a TWDT council with a trusted pool of players to vote on/go through and come to consensus on player ratings before next season. Having a group vote to decide seems way more fair. In defense of those involved this season we just played.., doing it alone is not easy and expecting one person to know the skill level of every player who signs up is an impossible task.

    Do an impartial group making individual decisions and then voting on ratings please.

  12. #12
    Cows 4 magic beans! Attacks's Avatar
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    It strikes out to me this looks a little complicated maybe because its new, the current method in its genuis is its simple, and can be read and worked out from a glance. The reason the 1-10 system struggled is due to poor decisions on ratings last season. I am for revising the current 1-10 system to include a 8 star slot, however that being said if it doesnt I still feel that the 1-10 system is still the best system. Also being said lets vote on these things and I will work with whatever system the majority agree on. I am not adverse to change if it can be proved a better system.
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  13. #13
    Major Crisis/Ownix Major Crisis's Avatar
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    I think we have tried different ratings systems in the past which have all 'failed'. We always went back to the current one.
    Major Crisis

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    Major Crisis/Ownix Major Crisis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claushouse View Post
    I think 98% of the zone really likes the current system of 6-Star and 7-Star, and that it has produced the best seasons of TWDT.


    Forums are statistically inaccurate, because people with complaints naturally gravitate towards posting, while people who are content don't.


    There are like 250-300 signups every season, and 10 people who are unhappy posting seems very potent on the forums where they represent 10 of 17 posters in a thread, despite representing 3-4% of players.


    Also, most complaints stem from the ratings, not the system itself.
    I agree. Only thing I think that should need a look is the 8* positition. Maybe I think like that cuz of last season I have been 8* for the first time in my life and only then u see the consequences of it. I think it's the worst possible rating you could have in wb/jav.
    Major Crisis

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    Quote Originally Posted by Major Crisis View Post
    I agree. Only thing I think that should need a look is the 8* positition. Maybe I think like that cuz of last season I have been 8* for the first time in my life and only then u see the consequences of it. I think it's the worst possible rating you could have in wb/jav.
    It really is. 8s not only have to battle for a spot agaisnt the other 8s(which are alot in number), but compete with 9s and 10s who are better players in theory. The only difference id consider would be creating a 8* spot, besides that i think the system is good.

    The main issue with this season was the ratings, which everyone saw how bad they were at the beginning of the season. Just get 3/4 players(veterans who are relatively active) to do ratings for each league, average it and it will be good.
    I really dont think its that hard, it takes like 20 mins to go through 1 league. I dont think most of us would mind doing it

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    Cows 4 magic beans! Attacks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kess View Post
    It really is. 8s not only have to battle for a spot agaisnt the other 8s(which are alot in number), but compete with 9s and 10s who are better players in theory. The only difference id consider would be creating a 8* spot, besides that i think the system is good.

    The main issue with this season was the ratings, which everyone saw how bad they were at the beginning of the season. Just get 3/4 players(veterans who are relatively active) to do ratings for each league, average it and it will be good.
    I really dont think its that hard, it takes like 20 mins to go through 1 league. I dont think most of us would mind doing it
    I had offered to do the warbird ratings last year as I was active and had written the hot or nots for last twl as well as captained the previous season, however Vys decided to go it alone and rate the warbirds himself dispite his fleeting activity
    British> my 18th tomoz $$
    Sol ^> 18 and scouse, so that two kids you have by now, brit?

    i.d.> I just farted and shit myself alittle bit

  17. #17
    Big Ego kentaro's Avatar
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    I think the idea of a 8*,7*,6* isnt bad

    perhaps a max of 26 between your top 3 players
    -if you have a 10 you can only have a two 8's along
    -or two 9's and one 8

    Points for this
    -This might help balance the league out and reward teams for trying to go for 3 leagues rather than stack 1. Though the star ratings would need a rework too.
    -This probably helps some of those 8*'s that dont get to play one more stacked teams while still keeping things competitive too
    -Also rewards the teams for picking the stronger 8*'s

    Quote Originally Posted by kess View Post
    It really is. 8s not only have to battle for a spot agaisnt the other 8s(which are alot in number), but compete with 9s and 10s who are better players in theory. The only difference id consider would be creating a 8* spot, besides that i think the system is good.

    The main issue with this season was the ratings, which everyone saw how bad they were at the beginning of the season. Just get 3/4 players(veterans who are relatively active) to do ratings for each league, average it and it will be good.
    I really dont think its that hard, it takes like 20 mins to go through 1 league. I dont think most of us would mind doing it
    Last edited by kentaro; 06-13-2017 at 03:55 PM.
    1:Foreign> i screenshot every time i get mvp in javs
    1:pascone> folder is empty :/
    1:Tiny> LOL
    1:Mega Newbie> uhauhauhauhauhauha

    1:Ricko> i havent played so well and gone 4-7 before

  18. #18
    House Targaryen Claushouse's Avatar
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    I can see a case for an 8-Star slot in base, but I'm still skeptical about WB/Jav.

    I think, for now, we're on the 7/6 train still, but using centigrade to change things up a bit.

    WB: 0-65, 0-75
    Jav: 0-65, 0-75
    Base: 0-65, 0-75, 0-75

    I like the idea of an additional 0-85 slot for base, it reduces the draft capital burden and helps captains go for more leagues.

    That said, it depends on signups. We expect 4 contenders in each league in an average 6-Team, and 2 non-contenders (unless there are 6 great caps like 2016 Fall, where there was legit competition in all 3 leagues from all 6.)

    Let's look at 8+ in WB this season (9+ bolded):

    ALF (Mythril, Delectable, Reaver, Jones, Turban)
    Power (Weak, Ricko, Okyo, Raazi, Beam)
    Brexit (Iron Survivor, Ease, Attacks, Geio, Olde)
    Baratheon (Best, Racketeer, Kentaro, Spezza)
    Paladin (Lasenza, Vys, Racka, Tanzu, Tripin, 24, Flew)
    Terrorist (Skepsis, Rasaq)

    We're talking about benching Jones, Weak, Attacks, Racka, and Tanzu, on top of the fact that Power wouldn't have advanced without their depth. ALF had four 9s and they didn't show half the time, Brexit had lag issues in the Finals, Best disappeared, Paladin had 3 of their 4 not show to Semis and Skepsis was a ghost.

    The distribution of WBs was already pretty good, and 8s like Turban, Beam, Geio, Olde, Kentaro, Spezza, Tripin, 24, Flew and Rasaq all got significant playing time because of lag and no shows.

    Restricting 9s and 10s wouldn't achieve much, other than pissing off talented players the odd time that three of them do show up to a match together.
    2:RaCka> I wonder what turban's real name is
    2gron> turb's name IRL is tellixador icantshow
    2:RaCka> LOL
    2:Heaven> LOl

    Ogron> what's your showrate, i got the next FA pick
    24> i can only show Week 2

  19. #19
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    power dominated so bad ppl wanna change the rules lol

  20. #20
    Registered User Jessup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zidane View Post
    power dominated so bad ppl wanna change the rules lol

    Lol Zid..

    Powers 6 star warbirds-----Aprix, Kim . Henry Saari, Vehicle , ixador, sassafras, M_M_god , uprise

    Powers 7 star Warbirds---- Bacon, Trasher, Roiwerk

    Powers 6 star Javelins----- Henry Saari, sassafras , uprise, Saol <er>

    Powers 7 Star Javelins----- Raazi, Ricko, Bacon, Vehicle



    You def had some of the silliest underrated players and a lot of them too. Props for picking them and taking advantage of it but..lololol

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